吉他中国新网址

 找回密码
 注册
搜索
查看: 2519|回复: 59

“学习吉他知识增强外语水平”系列之一

[复制链接]
发表于 2003-11-24 09:17:00 | 显示全部楼层

“学习吉他知识增强外语水平”系列之一

吉他中国微信公众号
为学习更多的吉他知识,了解外国最直接的咨询,同时提高大家的外语水平,从今日起将陆续登载国外著名音乐家学者的吉他文章,供大家学习,翻译,探讨。大家可以将自己的译作贴上来,也可以就一些语言点和知识点提出问题进行讨论,本其为:"Handmade" vs "Factory made"。欢迎大家积极参与!


[B]"Handmade" vs "Factory made"[/B] by Ron Fernández

Here are a few points which deal with the issue of "what is a handmade guitar".

In Spain, the most relevant distinction is between [B]guitarras de artesania [/B](artisan guitars or [B]guitarras de fabrica [/B](factory guitars), not what is a "handmade" guitar.

Typically, we find that artisan guitars or master luthier guitars are signed and dated. In contrast, "estudio", production (factory) and apprentice guitars are not normally signed and dated.

Traditionally all aspects of guitar production were governed by the vihuela guilds (from 12th the early 19th century). These old guilds had the force of law behind them. The guilds determined who could make instruments, what they were sold for, the acceptable quality standards, etc. Today, no such guilds exist, only voluntary luthiers' associations and workers' unions.

Currently guitar production in Spain is organized in 3 basic ways:

[B]Independent Artisan Workshops[/B]. In such shops, the master artisan has full control over design, manufacture of all parts and assembly. Each instrument is an original--it is a one of a kind. Thicknesses of soundboard, types and number of bracings are determined by the artisan according to his evaluation of the properties of the particular pieces of wood. Guitar parts are made in small quantities. The master works alone or with an apprentice, offspring or sometimes a partner. There is little division of labor compared with the factory method.Woods are air-dried for many years. Production is 12 to 30 guitars a year. Examples of world class makers in Spain are Felix Manzanero, Archangel Fernandez, Marcelino Barbero, Miguel Rodriquez of Cordoba, Manuel Reyes of Cordoba, Ignacio Fleta, Antonio Marin Montero, and many others.
[B]
Factory System[/B]. This produces a committee guitar. These can be of high quality.This system produces numerous copies from the same guitar plan. Many people make the parts and many people assemble the parts. Woods are air-dried and kiln dried.The bracings and thicknesses of parts are standarized and are not altered to respond to the individual characteristics of the specific pieces of wood.

[B]Journeyman System[/B]. This is a hybrid of the artisan and factory methods. In this system parts are manufactured by a number of people but a single experienced craftsman does all of the crucial assembly operations and modifies the thicknesses of parts according to his intuition. Finishing and fretting are typically done by a number of people in the factory.

Nowadays around Valencia, Spain aspects of the factory and journeyman system are combined in what are called artesan factories. In such situations certain guitar models are made by committees in the standard "factory" system while other more expensive, all-solid models are made by skilled workers who do the crucial assembly supported by factory workers who make the parts. Esteve, Zambra and Vicente Sanchis Guitars are made in artesan factories.




[此贴子已经被作者于2003-11-24 10:42:15编辑过]

发表于 2003-11-24 09:22:00 | 显示全部楼层
吉他中国抖音
唉呦。。。肚子疼,回来继续看。。。。

感谢哈哈。。
发表于 2003-11-24 09:47:00 | 显示全部楼层
GC视频号
应该是头痛的吧~~~
不行了不行了~~~眼又痛了~~闪!!
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 09:59:00 | 显示全部楼层
买琴买鼓,就找魔菇
给几个大家注意的事项,这类概念性文章最根本的要求就是“准确”。翻译时,每个关键的概念词都应反复推敲,否则,极易出现偏差。

就象以前翻译的“靠弦”和“勾弦”一样,一个“勾”字不知误导了多少人,甚至影响了整个中国吉他界的技术缺失。一字之差,差之千里。。。

大家在翻译概念性文章时要特别注意这个问题。
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 10:05:00 | 显示全部楼层
这篇文章写得很好,是很考验翻译的英文理解能力和汉语表达能力的和逻辑能力,而且有很不少的知识点。此类文章的翻译应以“信”为主,”达雅“为辅。
发表于 2003-11-24 10:05:00 | 显示全部楼层


这算不算专业英语?
俺不懂英语,所以请教这个问题:
我记得大学里好像有科技英语专业

发表于 2003-11-24 10:13:00 | 显示全部楼层
专业英语和英语专业不一样,SOUND

大学里说的专业英语指的是非英语专业必学的关于他们专业的英语。、

的确是一篇不错的文章。。。

哈哈说的对,技术性说明文章以信为主。
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 10:15:00 | 显示全部楼层
赫赫。。。郭老师,您可是博士研究生啊,总是那么谦虚,真是服了油~~汗~~弄得俺无地自容~~

既然说到,俺也就说说吧:这大概不能算专业英语,专业英语所依托的必须是一门正规的专业,比如科技英语,这门专业应该是大学课程有的科目,最起码是有坚实的理论体系,才能称为专业。吉他制作应属于一门”手艺和技艺“,谈不上专业。哈。

对了,关于“勾弦”的译法,原文应该是“悬空弹法”,勾弦是翻译者想当然翻译出来的。

发表于 2003-11-24 10:20:00 | 显示全部楼层
晕!我只能看个大概意思
发表于 2003-11-24 10:20:00 | 显示全部楼层
1、算是“古典吉他专业英语”,哈哈。
2、姑且当回“聊天博士”,嘿嘿
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 10:24:00 | 显示全部楼层
俺服了你,这文章你大概没看,它讲的是吉他制作~~~!!
发表于 2003-11-24 10:27:00 | 显示全部楼层
哈哈,给我们讲讲第2段吧,看了半个点了,卡在了第2段了。。。
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 10:28:00 | 显示全部楼层
小麦啊!我也等着你的译稿来学习呢~~~~!哎,怎么一个比一个谦虚。

说说吧,把第二段贴过来看看~~
发表于 2003-11-24 10:29:00 | 显示全部楼层
开个玩笑啊,别介意。
不过,我的英语水平确实很糟糕,所以非常佩服各位。

再者,文章中estudio这个词汇,没接触过音乐的人,比较难懂。

我刚问过我的同事,细细
发表于 2003-11-24 10:36:00 | 显示全部楼层
in spain, the most relevant distinction is between guitarras de artesania (artisan guitars or guitarras de fabrica (factory guitars), not what is a "handmade" guitar.

贴过来了。。。
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 10:47:00 | 显示全部楼层
in spain, the most relevant distinction is between guitarras de artesania (artisan guitars or guitarras de fabrica (factory guitars), not what is a "handmade" guitar。

这句话应该原文少了一个括号,另外,用词有误(西班牙人写的),这样是不是更好一些:

in spain, the most relevant distinction is between guitarras de artesania (artisan guitars) AND guitarras de fabrica (factory guitars), not what is a "handmade" guitar。
发表于 2003-11-24 10:58:00 | 显示全部楼层
在西班牙,吉他最恰当的分类是工匠制作的吉他和工厂生产的吉他,前者并不称做所谓的“手工制作”的吉他。

这样如何?

后半句意思其实是:并不是用是否是手工制作的吉他来作为区别的标准。



“在西班牙,吉他最恰当的分类是工匠制作的吉他和工厂生产的吉他,并不按所谓的“手工制作”的吉他来划分。”

对吗,哈哈


[此贴子已经被作者于2003-11-24 12:04:06编辑过]

 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 11:07:00 | 显示全部楼层
很厉害~~~我想了半天都想不出好词~
发表于 2003-11-24 11:10:00 | 显示全部楼层
那还好次呢!汗。。。
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 11:14:00 | 显示全部楼层
typically, we find that artisan guitars or master luthier guitars are signed and dated. in contrast, "estudio", production (factory) and apprentice guitars are not normally signed and dated.

比较典型的是,工匠吉他和大师吉他都有签名和日期,而练习琴,工厂琴和学徒琴一般没有签名和日期。

发表于 2003-11-24 11:31:00 | 显示全部楼层
traditionally all aspects of guitar production were governed by the vihuela guilds (from 12th the early 19th century). these old guilds had the force of law behind them. the guilds determined who could make instruments, what they were sold for, the acceptable quality standards, etc. today, no such guilds exist, only voluntary luthiers' associations and workers' unions.

传统上,吉他制作的各个方面都由比尤埃拉琴协会(12世纪至19世纪初级)统一规定。这些协会都受当时法律的制约。协会决定着谁可以制作乐器,乐器销售的目的以及普遍被接受的质量标准等。今天,此类的协会已经不复存在了,只有自发的乐器制作协会或工会。


[此贴子已经被作者于2003-11-24 11:58:44编辑过]

发表于 2003-11-24 11:33:00 | 显示全部楼层
currently guitar production in spain is organized in 3 basic ways:

目前,西班牙吉他制作主要有三种最基本的方式:


(赶紧把这段短的给抢了,就知道哈哈会墙这段)
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 11:53:00 | 显示全部楼层
ha !让给你了:)
发表于 2003-11-24 11:56:00 | 显示全部楼层
赶紧跟近吧。。。

高手们可以帮我们挑挑错误啥5地。。
发表于 2003-11-24 12:13:00 | 显示全部楼层
factory system. this produces a committee guitar. these can be of high quality.this system produces numerous copies from the same guitar plan. many people make the parts and many people assemble the parts. woods are air-dried and kiln dried.the bracings and thicknesses of parts are standarized and are not altered to respond to the individual characteristics of the specific pieces of wood

工厂体系.用于生产高质量厂琴.此类吉他质量较高.体系主要是用于生产大量得同一标准得吉他(用同一蓝本生产大量吉他). (采用流水线工作方式),一些人生产部件一些人组装.通常,木材采用风干和烘干两种方式.吉他得支架系统厚度等都是同意标准的.不会根据每块木材的特点而做相应的改变





发表于 2003-11-24 12:18:00 | 显示全部楼层
哈哈,在搞大比拼了?这会没有工夫,晚上来观摩观摩。最后一定要把全文串出来,功德无量哦。
发表于 2003-11-24 12:25:00 | 显示全部楼层
journeyman system. this is a hybrid of the artisan and factory methods. in this system parts are manufactured by a number of people but a single experienced craftsman does all of the crucial assembly operations and modifies the thicknesses of parts according to his intuition. finishing and fretting are typically done by a number of people in the factory.

nowadays around valencia, spain aspects of the factory and journeyman system are combined in what are called artesan factories. in such situations certain guitar models are made by committees in the standard "factory" system while other more expensive, all-solid models are made by skilled workers who do the crucial assembly supported by factory workers who make the parts. esteve, zambra and vicente sanchis guitars are made in artesan factories.



学徒期满的工匠系统. 这是工匠和工厂方法的一个混血儿. 在这一个系统部份中被许多的人制造,但是一个单一富有经验的工匠做所有的决定性的集会操作而且依照他的直觉修正部份的厚度. 终结和磨损典型地被工厂的许多人做.
时下在 valencia ,工厂的 spain 方面和学徒期满的工匠系统的周围在什么被称为 artesan 工厂被联合. 在如此的情形中,某吉他模型被标准 "工厂" 系统的委员会做当其他的时候更贵的,所有的- 固体模型被做被制造部份的工厂工人支援的决定性的集会熟练的工人做. esteve , zambra 和 vicente sanchis 吉他在 artesan 工厂中被做.

-----哈哈,这是金山快译的功劳,哈哈

发表于 2003-11-24 12:26:00 | 显示全部楼层
I fule you.
版主集合了哈哈
发表于 2003-11-24 12:33:00 | 显示全部楼层
journeyman system. this is a hybrid of the artisan and factory methods. in this system parts are manufactured by a number of people but a single experienced craftsman does all of the crucial assembly operations and modifies the thicknesses of parts according to his intuition. finishing and fretting are typically done by a number of people in the factory

人工体系. 这是一种在生产中混和了手工制作和工厂生产的方式.在这种系统里面,先由大量的人采用机械生产的方式完成一个大概.然后再由一个有经验的技师根据他自己的直觉来对吉他的关键部分进行主装,对厚度?(thicknesses)进行修改. 最后通常由一般工人来打磨,杀青
发表于 2003-11-24 12:36:00 | 显示全部楼层
金山还是能看出一个大概..不过电脑随便怎么样也不能意义...
像"学徒期满的工匠系统"这样的翻译就......!@$#@%$
发表于 2003-11-24 12:36:00 | 显示全部楼层
走音老大,金山快意翻的吧?
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 12:37:00 | 显示全部楼层
WALK,你的进山快癔真是强啊,面板居然翻译成“固体”~~~
发表于 2003-11-24 12:37:00 | 显示全部楼层
以下是引用小麦吉他在2003-11-24 12:36:00的发言:
走音老大,金山快意翻的吧?

是啊是啊,嘿嘿
发表于 2003-11-24 12:39:00 | 显示全部楼层
“工厂的 spain 方面和学徒期满的工匠系统的周围在什么被称为 artesan 工厂被联合”

这句话也逗呀


好像在问人家。。。
发表于 2003-11-24 12:43:00 | 显示全部楼层
哈哈的英语水平确实很高,俺领教过。
下次再来大师,哈哈去当翻译吧,顺手还能示范,嘿嘿
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 12:46:00 | 显示全部楼层
journeyman system,意思应该是“师傅带徒弟式的小工厂”。
发表于 2003-11-24 12:48:00 | 显示全部楼层
committee guitar应该是指一帮人在一起瞎颤忽分工做的吉他。。。
发表于 2003-11-24 12:49:00 | 显示全部楼层
在看了bream的dvd后~~开始喜欢vihuela琴了~~~~很好听...
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 12:50:00 | 显示全部楼层
COMMITTE:合作制吉他。集体创作,赫赫~~~
 楼主| 发表于 2003-11-24 12:51:00 | 显示全部楼层
印度的吉他?
您需要登录后才可以回帖 登录 | 注册

本版积分规则

Archiver|手机版|小黑屋|吉他中国官方

GMT+8, 2025-5-6 23:56

Powered by Discuz!

© 2001-2024 Discuz! Team.

快速回复 返回顶部 返回列表